Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 20:30:00 -0000
From: "Mel Grindol" 
Subject: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

Some time ago there was a discussion about transporting stoves on airlines.  The conclusion being that most traditional backpackers stoves are not allowed on commercial airplanes for safety reasons.  (Thank god Kaczensky (sp?) didn't have a modern stove.)

A couple of stoves were mentioned as possible alternatives.  Well, today I was flipping through a catalog my wife borrowed from a co-worker (thanks Julie).  They have a little stove designed to burn twigs that is cheap.  Check it out at :

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/

and search on "Pocket Cooker" to get a picture and description.  (it should be the 8th item in the search results list)  Very small and it's hard to go wrong for $10. :)

They also have an Alcohol Stove that, IIRC, should be able to be taken on an airplane.

Mel
- ---



Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 23:29:13 EST
From: Bluecanoe2@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

In a message dated 1/6/1999 4:56:08 PM EST, grindol@my-dejanews.com writes:

<< They also have an Alcohol Stove that, IIRC, should be able to be taken on
an airplane.

Nope!  Can't do it even an alcohol stove!

There are three wood burning ones actually. Two of them have fans to blow air
in by Sierra.  a big one adna small one.  Then there is a flat folding one
that depends on a draft to suck in air.  It folds up pretty flat.  For those
of us who like to cook on wood fires, they are pretty neat.  Butn about
anything, pine cones included.

John



Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 08:07:20 -0800
From: "John C. Winskill" 
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] FW: Transportable stoves

I own the Pocket Cooker (as well as a couple of sizes of the Zip Stove;
description following):
A far superior stove which burns twigs, pinecones etc is the Zip Stove.
It is more expensive (in one form it comes nestled in its own pot/cook
kit and bag) but is far more efficient and self contained.  The stove
does require one AA battery to operated.  The battery drives a small fan
which is somewhat adjustable and the firebox then becomes a small blast
furnace.  The stove is also very light.

John Winskill



Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1999 11:33:16 -0600 (CST)
From: "Robert C. Cline" 
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

Isn't it the fuel that is not allowed, rather than the stove?
 Robert

Mel wrote:

>Some time ago there was a discussion about transporting stoves on
>airlines.  The conclusion being that most traditional backpackers stoves
>are not allowed on commercial airplanes for safety reasons.



Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 11:27:42 -0800
From: skerries@hotmail.com 
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

At 11:33 AM 1/7/99 -0600, you wrote:
>Isn't it the fuel that is not allowed, rather than the stove?
> Robert
>
In a word, no. Government regulations (not airline policies) forbid
carrying not only the fuels, but any stoves or fuel bottles that have EVER
contained fuel (Sorry for the "shouting" - just have to stress this.) This
is the case in Canada at least, and since we mostly take our cues from the
US FAA, I imagine it's true in the States too. I believe the concern is
that fuel fumes are actually potentially more dangerous than liquid fuel.
Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Philip T.
N49°16' W123°08' 
"The opinions expressed in this posting are not necessarily those of my
employer, or indeed, of any sentient being."



Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1999 15:45:35 EST
From: Bluecanoe
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

In a message dated 1/7/1999 1:11:30 PM EST, rcline writes:

<< Isn't it the fuel that is not allowed, rather than the stove?
  Robert >>

Nope!  The stove too whether new or used or cleaned or anything.Fuel has
always been taboo.  Now it is the stove too.

Wanna know why?  The feds raided a place that was building bombs into camping
stove fuel tanks.  The X-ray machines only picked up the image of the stove
and tank, not the inner workings of teh bomb.

I uded tobe a police officer, have lots of friends that still are.  One showed
me the "blotter" as they are called outlining how to recognise them.

Frankly, I can live without my stove on board or a mad bombers "stove bomb" on
board also.  A small price to pay to keep teh plane in the air and not on the
ground in pieces.

John



Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1999 14:21:59 -0700 (MST)
From: Mark Zen
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

On Thu, 7 Jan 1999, Product Information Department wrote:

> At 11:33 AM 1/7/99 -0600, you wrote:
> >Isn't it the fuel that is not allowed, rather than the stove?
> > Robert
> >
> In a word, no. Government regulations (not airline policies) forbid
> carrying not only the fuels, but any stoves or fuel bottles that have EVER
> contained fuel (Sorry for the "shouting" - just have to stress this.) This
> is the case in Canada at least, and since we mostly take our cues from the
> US FAA, I imagine it's true in the States too. I believe the concern is
> that fuel fumes are actually potentially more dangerous than liquid fuel.
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Cheers,
> Philip T.

you are correct in your assumption ;-) my conversations w/combat pilots
indicated they were most concerned with not coming back with half a tank
of gas, or less, the more VAPOR [less liquid] the more explosive...

mark

#------canoeist[at]netbox[dot]com----http://www.diac.com/~zen/mark ----
#
mark zen                      o,    o__              o_/|   o_.
po box 474                   

Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 12:22:14 -0700
From: Steve Jernigan 
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

Hi All!
I had the opportunity to try one of the Pocket Cookers (or a similar item)
a couple of years ago. Alas, there is always a good possibility of
"operator error", but I never did get it to boil water. (sure got my
coffeepot black, tho!) Anyone else on the list ever really USE one? It
seemed to be a just the thing for an emergency stove in the trunk, or on a
snowmachine, but I just couldn't get enough "HOT!!!" out of it. Just
curious.  Steve J.



Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 19:53:39 -0800
From: rdiaz@ix.netcom.com
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

I reviewed one of these for my newsletter back in 1994.  Not the Sierra
Stove with battery but rather one that was made in Israel and sold
through Gander Mountain for $15.95.  I haven't checked but was told by
some readers who followed up a year or two later that it no longer was
being offered.

The stove is/was pyramid shape, totally collapsible to a flat package
that would fit in a provided nylon bag.  Folded down it was the size of
a small book.  It has a door on one side.  the object is to feed in wood
from the side rather than from the top as in the Sierra Stove.  This
allows you to use more than just twigs.  You could get a small branch
and feed it in if you liked, but twigs could be also feed in that way. 
The top had prongs on which a coffee pot would sit and blacken a lot of
course.  It weighed slightly over a pound.

The stated time for boiling 3 cups of water at sea level was 10
minutes.  However, using quite dry kindling, I got 3 cups boiling like
mad in just 5 minutes and extrapolated that it would do a quart in
around 8 minutes certainly.  That is not bad compared to the stated 5 to
6 minute for boiling a quart of water on gas stoves such as MSRs. 
Obviously different wood supply would achieve different results but it
most definitely will bring water to boil.

I think its shape is what made it work so well, a terrific draft from
the sides and bottom and the pyramid sides concentrating all that heat
up in a relatively small area where you put the pot.

I know that there are other such products floating around.  My quest for
one was peaked by a woman I knew (the same one with the duct taped neck
gasket) who had found one some where in the Adirondaks and regularly
boiled water for tea and coffee on it just using twings off the ground. 
Hers had last a few seasons but was on the verge of burning through the
last time I saw it which was quite a few years ago.

I liked that it did not require a battery and folded flat.  Also that
ability to feed sizable branches in from the side and push them in
further as they burnt.  It looked like something that you could carry
along with a small supply of firestarter type wood or the Fire Ribbon
stuff in a tube.  This way, if you ran into situations where everything
was wet at your campsite, you would have enough to see you through with
what you brought along.  It weigth terms, the stove and the emergency
back up fire starter stuff would be just slightly more than the lighest
gas stove and fuel.  But of course you would and could use what you
found along the way and never resort to the backup fuel.

ralph 
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter
PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024
Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz@ix.netcom.com
"Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag."
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------

HR NOSHADE>

Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1999 08:11:13 -0500 
From: "Sisler, Clyde"
Subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

I just bought something called Esbit Pocket Stove for emergency use from
Campmor for $9.99 that runs on solid fuel tablets.  Haven't tried it yet but
the propoganda talks about how it's designed to produce more 'Hot'.

http://www.campmor.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prmenbr=226&prrfnbr
=1055



Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 09:17:04 -0700
From: Steve Jernigan 
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Transportable stoves

At 07:53 PM 1/7/99 -0800, rdiaz@ix.netcom.com wrote:

>The stove is/was pyramid shape, totally collapsible to a flat package
>It weighed slightly over a pound.
>
>Obviously different wood supply would achieve different results but it
>most definitely will bring water to boil.
>

Sounds like the same basic stove. I seem to recall burning my fingers on a
hinged door on the side while loading twigs. Might be worth a second look,
'cause it sure would be a handy little item. 
Thanx everyone for the feedback!  S.